Bahu Virupaksha

Join Date 09/2004

THE SITUATION IN AFGHANISTAN

USA is in deep trouble

In the bad old days of the Roman Empire, there was a territory that the Romans tried to conquer for nearly 200 years, but never quite succeded. Known as Parthia, this territory roughly corresponds to south western Afghanistan and parts of the Iranian plateau. USA is meeting stiff resistance in exactly the same region and surprisingly for the same reason--imperial overstretch.

While Iraq is getting all the attention, the original war on terror centred on Afghanistan is not receiving adequate coverage. The removal of the Taleban was welcomed all over the world and the USA did have the backing of the world community on that scopre. However the attentiona span of the US Administration was rather short and soon diverted its gaze to Iraq and see what a glorious mess the USA and Iraq are in. Had the Americans and their backers concentrated on AFGHANISTAN then the war on terror would have reached a turning point. By attacking Iraq without any provocation and waging a brutal and reppressive war there, the USA has created a huge propaganda bonnanza for the al-qaeda. In Afghanistan itself the Taliban are ressuregent and in the countryside just ouside the lage cities there are signs of the revival of the Taleban. Just yesterday 4 US marines lost their lives.

The real reason for American failure in Afghanistan is the fact that the USA relies on the word of its client king. Gen Musharaf of Pakistan. He signed on the the war on teror as defined by Bush and the Bushmen rather reluctantly and has been making a show of compliance while all the time the taleban are able to use Pakistani territory in order tro retreat and regroup. There is credible information that bin laden is hiding in ther mountains of North west province. The deep seated tribal loyalties make it difficult for any army to operate there and those familiar with Rudyard Kipling's Kim will understand the reasons.

The war on terror in which the Pakistan Army is an unwilling partner has already led to an insurgency in parts of Baluchistan, a province of Pakistan. In fact the Afghan situation is getting bleak and it is time for the USA to think hard and long about its options. The present ituation is too dangerous for the safety and security of the regiion.

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The real reason for American failure in Afghanistan is the fact that the USA relies on the word of its client king. Gen Musharaf of Pakistan.

your voice added to the taliban makes 145 people that think America has failed in Afganistan.

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I do not think that the USA should fail in that region. It is too strategic a region for failure. However I do blame the choice of allies in this war, and the war against terror should have been confined to Afghanistan and not extended to Iraq in order to help another US ally.

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+350

USA is meeting stiff resistance in exactly the same region and surprisingly for the same reason--imperial overstretch.

This is one of the dumbest things you've ever said, Bahu. The two situations could not be any more different, and if you really think we're there to "conquer Parthia" on our way to empire, you're a bigger nut case than I previously imagined.

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In her recent visit to meet President Karzai, Sec of State dr Condaleeza Rice has made the same assessment and called upon Pakistan to be more effective in its watr on terror.

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Gen Musharaf of Pakistan. He signed on the the war on teror as defined by Bush and the Bushmen rather reluctantly and has been making a show of compliance while all the time the taleban are able to use Pakistani territory in order tro retreat and regroup. There is credible information that bin laden is hiding in ther mountains of North west province.

I rightly pointed out 5 years back where Bin Laden was hiding and the involvement of the Pakistani ISI in sheltering him.

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Quoting Moderateman,

reply 1

your voice added to the taliban makes 145 people that think America has failed in Afganistan.

Up to 147 with myself and the author of this article.

http://smallwarsjournal.com/blog/journal/docs-temp/120-jebnoun.pdf

Quoting Daiwa,

reply 3

Always nut-cases for different opinions, tisc … Maybe it would be easier to explain your version of success instead of telling us we are wrong here.

... and the anointed one is sitting on his arse ... waiting for the teleprompter to 'get real'.

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148

Canada's New Role i n Afghanistan -- 2011 to 2014

We are outa there as we have no interest what so ever in protecting the American drug trade.

Farmers in an area of eastern Afghanistan that has been opium-free for years say they are growing poppies again. Residents of Tagab district accuse the government of reneging on promises to reward them if they switched to other crops. As in other parts of the country, farmers have also been tempted back into poppy cultivation because of the spiralling rising price of opium. Farmers who abandoned the crop three or four years ago, like Mohammad Ajan, say resuming opium production is the only sensible economic choice they can make. [...] The situation in Tagab appears to bear out forecasts made by Afghanistan’s counter-narcotics ministry and the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, UNODC, both of which predict a nationwide rise in production in 2011. Blight killed off half of last year’s poppy crop, driving prices up to their highest level since 2004 and creating an additional incentive for wavering farmers.

"Flying over it, it's like flying over the tulip lands in Holland," a senior British officer based at Kandahar Airfield said in a recent interview.

In the poor and broken streets of Kandahar city, the riches of the drug trade are openly flaunted only blocks from the provincial reconstruction team site, the base from which Canadian soldiers run security patrols through the city.

"See those new houses," said an Afghan driver while escorting a CanWest News reporter through the city one day. "Those belong to the drug guys," he said, pointing to several new and glittering mansions rising up behind razor-wire fences.

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It seems that it is not quite so cut-n-dry (2006). There is a big difference in Democracy in action and democratic elections. Someone (?) said that when Fascism comes to America, it will have a flag in one hand and a bible in the other … well it’s here.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4997678.stm

Did a little research and came up with this list from an anonymous source …

If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. -- James Madison

'When the government fears the people it is a democracy....when the people fear their government it is tyranny...' --- Thomas Jefferson

Those who give up essential liberties for temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -- Benjamin Franklin

The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it to be always kept alive.– Thomas Jefferson

The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the instruments of tyranny at home. – James Madison

The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders...tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. – Herman Goering

I love America more than any other country in this world, and, exactly for this reason, I insist on the right to criticize her perpetually. – James Baldwin

Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices. – Voltaire

The cry has been that when war is declared, all opposition should be hushed. A sentiment more unworthy of a free country could hardly be propagated. – William Ellery Channing

"if there be one principle more deeply written than any other in the mind of every American, it is that we should have nothing to do with conquest." -- Thomas Jefferson

Criticism in a time of war is essential to the maintenance of any kind of democratic government. – Sen. Robert Taft, (R) Ohio

Fascism will come wrapped in a flag and carrying a Bible. ~ Sinclair Lewis 1935

"patriotism is the last refuge of scoundrels." - Samuel Johnson

"If the American people ever allow the banks to control issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers occupied." -Thomas Jefferson

"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists." -J. Edgar Hoover, former head of the FBI

BEWARE THE LEADER WHO BANGS THE DRUMS of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know ? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar."

Instead of reviewing the indesputable expansionism and imperialism of the past, which is still going strong today, the American sheeple look to the USG for direction and purpose, go figure.

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Quoting Daiwa,

reply 3

USA is meeting stiff resistance in exactly the same region and surprisingly for the same reason--imperial overstretch.

This is one of the dumbest things you've ever said, Bahu. The two situations could not be any more different, and if you really think we're there to "conquer Parthia" on our way to empire, you're a bigger nut case than I previously imagined.

"War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives. A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of the people. Only a small 'inside' group knows what it is about. It is conducted for the benefit of the very few, at the expense of the very many. Out of war a few people make huge fortunes."

"I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents."

- General Smedley Butler
United States Marine Corps
Congressional Medal of Honor Recipient

Permanent Bases?

This building boom has hardly been confined to FOBs. Construction and expansion work at bases far larger than FOBs, including the mega-bases at Bagram and Kandahar, is ongoing, often at a startling pace. The Army, for example, has indicated it plans to build a 24,000 square-foot, $10-million command-and-control facility as well as a “Joint Defense Operations Center” with supporting amenities — from water storage tanks to outdoor landscaping — at Bagram Air Base. At bustling Kandahar Air Field, the military has offered contracts for a variety of upgrades, including a $28.5 million deal for the construction of an outdoor shelter for fighter aircraft, as well as new operations and maintenance facilities and more apron space, among a host of other improvements.

The building boom occurring on U.S. bases across Afghanistan and the contracts for future construction being awarded at the moment seem to confirm that, whatever the White House has in mind, the military is operating on something closer to the Petraeus timeline. The new Special Operations base at Mazar-e-Sharif, to take but one of many examples, may not be completed and fully occupied for at least a year and a half. Other construction contracts, not yet even awarded, are expected to take a year or more to complete. And military timelines suggest that, if the Pentagon gets its way, American troop levels may not dip below the numbers present when Obama took office, approximately 36,000 troops, until 2016 or beyond.

At the moment, the American people are being offered one story about how the American war in Afghanistan is to proceed, while in Afghanistan their tax dollars are being invested in another trajectory entirely. The question is: How permanent are U.S. bases in Afghanistan? And if they are not meant to be used for a decade or more to come, why is the Pentagon still building as if they were?

http://griid.org/2010/10/21/how-permanent-are-america%E2%80%99s-afghan-bases/

It,s a pile of BS that the US is leaving. Get re-elected and flip again. Then attack IRAN.

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Quoting myfist0,

reply 9

It,s a pile of BS that the US is leaving. Get re-elected and flip again. Then attack IRAN.

The nation has got to want you to stay there. The US has never stayed where the host nations elected government didn't want us. Example: Subic Bay and Clark Field, both extensive in scope and capability, in the Philippines (funny the US "Empire" didn't keep that one). Every territory of the US has the opportunity to leave the US. Puerto Rico votes on it from time to time, but can seem to give up the US for whatever reason. Haiti was occupied by the US for a time, glad we are out of there. Panama was not just a money maker, it was a strategic location. Why did we give that back? The simple fact is the host countries want the US there for their own purposes, be it financial, economic, defensive, or any combination there of. Do you know how many US military personnel are serving in Canada? This insinuation of US imperialism makes me laugh. We surely could have had a much larger slice of the world than we do now. BTW, when has an empire ever paid the occupied nation for its troops to be there? It seems General Butler grew a more liberal conscience after drawing his pay for decades. He won't be the last, but why should we care? It's his opinion, and a 33 year hypocrite does little to impress me. Sorry, we spent a lot more on re-building Europe with a little thing called the Marshal Plan, you'll have to do better than a few bases in the middle east.

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The military is moved around the world like pawns on a chess board to make sure that the coporatocracies are installed.

Corporatocracy, in social theories that focus on conflicts and opposing interests within society, denotes a system of government that serves the interest of, and may be run by, corporations and involves ties between government and business. Where corporations, conglomerates, and/or government entities with private components, control the direction and governance of a country, including carrying out economic planning notwithstanding the 'free market' label.

Just because the country does not fly your flag does not mean they are not totally dominated and controlled by the US interests.

737 U.S. Military Bases = Global Empire

Interestingly enough, the thirty-eight large and medium-sized American facilities spread around the globe in 2005 -- mostly air and naval bases for our bombers and fleets -- almost exactly equals Britain's thirty-six naval bases and army garrisons at its imperial zenith in 1898. The Roman Empire at its height in 117 AD required thirty-seven major bases to police its realm from Britannia to Egypt, from Hispania to Armenia. Perhaps the optimum number of major citadels and fortresses for an imperialist aspiring to dominate the world is somewhere between thirty-five and forty. http://www.alternet.org/story/47998

EDIT: South Korea want em out and thats the 1st 1 I looked at. Couple hundred other countries to go

The South Korean people do not appreciate the security our soldiers provide. The way some of them treat our soldiers ought to be a national scandal. Many off-post businesses don’t even let Americans through their front doors. The degree of anti-Americanism in South Korea is sufficient to be a significant force protection issue in the event of hostilities. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/04/11/opinion/main6386737.shtml

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Quoting Nitro Cruiser,

reply 10

Sorry, we spent a lot more on re-building Europe with a little thing called the Marshal Plan, you'll have to do better than a few bases in the middle east.

This list any help here?

Supported US locations in the Middle East

US Army Bases in Kuwait

Active Facilities
Ali Al Salem AB
Camp Arifjan
Camp Buehring
Camp Doha
Camp Fox
Camp Navistar
Camp New York
Camp Patriot
Camp Spearhead
Camp Victory
Camp Virginia
Camp Wolf
the Middle East IAP [KCIA]
the Middle East Naval Base
the Middle East Navy Base
Udairi Range

Old Facilities
Ahmed Al Jaber AB
Camden Yards
Camp Moreell
Failaka Island
Mina Al Ahmadi

The Kabals

US Army
Camp Big Sky Oasis
Camp Champion
Camp Fox
Camp Guardian
Camp Lancer
Camp Maine
Camp New Jersey
Camp New York
Camp Pennsylvania
Camp Spearhead
Camp Victory
Camp Virginia
Camp Wolf

US Marine Corps
Camp Betio
Camp Commando
Camp Coyote
Camp Matilda
Camp Pelelieu
Camp Ripper
Camp Ryan
Camp Shoup
Camp Soloman Islands

US Army Bases in Saudi Arabia

Dammam
Dhahran AB
Eskan Village
Hofuf
Jeddah AB
Jeddah
Jubail
Khamis Mushayt AB
Khobar Towers
King Khalid Military City
Prince Sultan AB
Riyadh AB
Tabuk AB
Taif AB
Yanbu
Khobar Towers
King Khalid Military City
Prince Sultan AB
Riyadh AB
Tabuk AB
Taif AB
Yanbu

US Army Bases in United Arab Emirates

Al Dhafra AB
Fujairah
Fujairah IAP
Jebel Ali
Mina Zayed
Port Rashid

US Army Bases in Bahrain

Manama
Mina Salman
Muharraq
Shaikh Isa AB

US Army Bases in Oman

Masirah AB
Mina Qabus
Muscat
Al Musnana AB
Seeb AB
Thumrait AB
Salalah

US Army Bases in Qatar

Al Udeid AB
Camp Snoopy
Camp As Sayliyah QA
Doha
Doha IAP
Umm Said
Falcon-78 ASP
Mesaieed

US Army Bases in Iraq (general locations sorted by number of soldiers)

Abu Ghraib Prison
Al Asad Air Base
Al Tahreer
Al-Amal
Al-Hurya Al-Awal
Balad Air Base
Camp Al-Nasr
Camp Blue Diamond
Camp Brassfield-Mora
Camp Caldwell
Camp Cedar
Camp Cuervo
Camp Danger
Camp Dragoon
Camp Falcon
Camp Fallujah
Camp Freedom I
Camp Hope
Camp Hurricane Pt.
Camp Junction City
Camp Liberty
Camp Liberty
Camp Lima
Camp Manhattan
Camp Performance
Camp Stryker
Camp Sustainer
Camp Taji
FOB Duke
FOB Echo
FOB Iskandariyah
FOB Pacesetter
FOB Pack Horse
FOB Ridgeway
FOB Scania
FOB Speicher
FOB Summerall
Kirkuk
Log Base Seitz
LSA Blackjack East
Mosul Air Base
Tallil Air Base
Tikrit Palace complex

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Quoting Nitro Cruiser,

reply 10

Example: Subic Bay and Clark Field, both extensive in scope and capability, in the Philippines (funny the US "Empire" didn't keep that one).

Philippines Orders U.S. to Leave Strategic Navy Base at Subic Bay...

http://www.nytimes.com/1991/12/28/world/philippines-orders-us-to-leave-strategic-navy-base-at-subic-bay.html

“As the old saying goes, ‘Guests, like fish, begin to smell after three days,’ ” Colonel Reese wrote. “Since the signing of the 2009 Security Agreement, we are guests in Iraq, and after six years in Iraq, we now smell bad to the Iraqi nose.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/31/world/middleeast/31adviser.html

“The general lack of progress in essential services and good governance is now so broad that it ought to be clear that we no longer are moving the Iraqis “forward.” Below is an outline of the information on which I base this assessment:”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/31/world/middleeast/31advtext.html?pagewanted=1

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One can always find a source to suit their view:

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/Special/2011/04/29/Some-Iraqis-want-US-forces-to-stay/UPI-30241304090590/

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iraq/7971959/Iraqis-want-American-to-stay.html

The NY Times? They lean left about as much as Anthony Wiener in a Twitter photo. Good thing they don't have an agenda?

Lots of Progressives don't want the US presence that exists in the world (but they do like the aid sent when disaster happens, such as the Tsunami's in the Indian ocean and more recently Japan).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-13652176

The reason? "Many Asian nations have become fearful of China's recent military expansion."

Since everyone is an adult here, everyone should realize what is said in public and what is whispered in government, back-room deals is often not the same. Remember when you click Google they don't list by truth or relevance (it's either a popularity contest or what they want you to see). It's the persons responsibility to drill down to the meat of it. In my present job, I get the military feeds, some of which are available to the public. I'm always amazed and the crud piled on top that the public ravenously consumes without looking a little further. They get to what they want to hear and that must be the truth.

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Quoting BoobzTwo,

reply 13

Philippines Orders U.S. to Leave Strategic Navy Base at Subic Bay...

Well if all the world has to do is "order" the "Empire" to leave, I guess there is nothing to fear. So here's the real question, why aren't they?

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Quoting BoobzTwo,

reply 12

Quoting Nitro Cruiser, reply 10

Sorry, we spent a lot more on re-building Europe with a little thing called the Marshal Plan, you'll have to do better than a few bases in the middle east.

This list any help here?

Supported US locations in the Middle East

Some of these are located at the host countries airports, some on shared installations, and some are temporary (tents). But if you want to call those "bases" into play to make your point, so be it. It sounds better if the 100's of the "Empires" bases are stepping on the necks of the poor down trodden in these locations with their iron boot. But what is one to believe, some "737 U.S. Military Bases = Global Empire" story or ones own lying eyes?

Ever been to Bahrain? The main base is located at there Terminal Port facilities, with a few hundred military personnel and probably an equal number of civilians and contractors. About the only offensive capability is the occasional visiting warships. The new indoor rock climbing wall is pretty awesome though.

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[quote who="myfist0" reply="11" id="2945717"]EDIT: South Korea want em out and thats the 1st 1 I looked at. Couple hundred other countries to go

The South Korean people do not appreciate the security our soldiers provide. The way some of them treat our soldiers ought to be a national scandal. Many off-post businesses don’t even let Americans through their front doors. The degree of anti-Americanism in South Korea is sufficient to be a significant force protection issue in the event of hostilities. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/04/11/opinion/main6386737.shtml[/quote]

Perhaps you should look past the first thing you see on the search engine. It might not fit your desired worldview, but you'll understand more.

US– SK Relations High Now

1.USSouth Korean relations are high due toSouth Korea’s failed attempts at détente.

Boot, Senior fellow for National Security Studies, May 31, 2010

(Max, “Americais Still the best Guarantor of Freedom and prosperity”, http://www.cfr.org/publication/22247/america_is_still_the_best_guarantor_of_freedom_and_prosperity.html, DA 6/22/10, jb, sob)

In justifying his reversal, Hatoyama said that "we cannot afford to reduce the U.S.military deterrence" because of "political uncertainties remaining in East Asia." There is no shortage of such uncertainties with the Chinese navy becoming increasingly assertive in moving into Japanese waters and with North Korea, which has missiles that can easily hitJapan, sinking a South Korean naval ship with the loss of 46 sailors. The latter incident naturally has focused attention inSeoul and served to accelerate the reaffirmation of close American-Korean ties that had already begun with the election of the more conservative President Lee Myung-bak in 2008. The anti-Americanism that had been prevalent inSouth Korea only a few years ago has all but disappeared, and it is not only (or even mainly) because of President Obama's vaunted charm. It is largely becauseSouth Korea has tried detente and found that it did nothing to moderate the aggressive behavior of the North Korean regime.

2. Withdrawal improbable – South Korea wants the US to stay longer

Korea Times 10

(“ROK-US more effective to counter NK”, February 24, 2010 http://www.airpower.maxwell.af.mil/airchronicles /apj/apj08/fal08/wood.htmlAccessed 6/22/10 AW GW)

Defense Minister Kim Tae-young expressed hope Wednesday that the U.S.-led defense system would stay intact in coming years amid the lingering North Korean military threat.

Referring to the planned transition of operational control (OPCON) of South Korean troops during wartime from the U.S. to Korean commanders in 2012, Kim said the military was putting forth the best efforts to take over OPCON in 2012.

He said the ROK-U.S. combined defense posture would be more effective in defendingSouth Koreafor the time being, given the lingering threat posed by North Korean missile and nuclear programs.

"I also hope that the U.S.-led defense scheme will remain further, given the North Korean nuclear and missile threat," Kim said at a lecture hosted by a naval defense research institute inSeoul.

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You were correct that I did not look to deeply into this matter regarding Korea but thanks for reminding me to look.

http://gowans.wordpress.com/2010/05/20/the-sinking-of-the-cheonan-another-gulf-of-tonkin-incident/

or another Maine?

That has got to be the biggest joke on the planet now with the torpedo under glass. Are they actually serious that a torpedo would split a ship in half but almost the whole torpedo is intact? Also every major event this decade just happens to happen when Americans are conducting military exorcises.

Seems awful convenient that relations between North and South were among the best since the cease fire with the Sunshine Policy and american relations were worsening with South Koreans and all of a sudden we have another Maine blowing up. The American Industrial Complex cannot have peace so they manufacture wars.

I have read many times that the North is willing to unify as long as the is NO AMERICAN involvement so again, just your presence causes tension and hostilities to continue.

---

You made me laugh with that CFR link. I make a post about the American Corporatocracy and you post a link that is the American Corporatocracy propaganda page. These guys are the mafia of the world and I am supposed to swallow what they call PR?

There is an especially large American presence in the Middle East, one of the world's most crisis-prone regions. For all the anti-Americanism in the Arab world, almost all the states bordering what they call the Arabian Gulf support substantial American bases. These governments are worried about the looming Iranian threat and know that only the United States can offer them protection. They are happy to deal with China, but it would never occur to a single sultan or sheik that the People's Liberation Army will protect them from Iranian intimidation.
http://www.cfr.org/international-peace-and-security/america-still-best-guarantor-freedom-prosperity/p22247

What a crock of shit. It's crisis prone DUE TO AMERICAN PRESENCE. Always Iran Iran Iran, manufacturing another enemy to keep the military complex running. The world is wising up to all the BS the American Government is shoveling out. When I need a good laugh I will read the CFR funny papers.

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+350

Speaking of crocks of shit:

Quoting myfist0,

reply 18

Quoting myfist0,

reply 18

I have read many times that the North is willing to unify as long as the is NO AMERICAN involvement so again, just your presence causes tension and hostilities to continue.

You should apply for a job as their version of Baghdad Bob... Pyongyang Peter, perhaps.

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Quoting Daiwa,

reply 19

You should apply for a job as their version of Baghdad Bob... Pyongyang Peter, perhaps.

ROFLMFAO. That is real funny how you seem to think that the evil propaganda is their doing. I guess next you will tell me that the evil Socialist are starving out the South by closing trade.

The South Korean military announced that it would resume psychological warfare directed at North Korea. This would include both loudspeaker and FM radio propaganda broadcasts across the DMZ. Meanwhile, a commander in the North Korean People’s Army stated, “If South Korea establishes new psychological warfare services, we will fire against them in order to eliminate them,” according to a report carried by the Chosun Central News Agency (KCNA).^[106]

South Korea began propaganda broadcasts into North Korea by radio on 25 May. North Korea responded by putting its troops on high alert, and severed most remaining ties and communications with South Korea in response to what it called a "smear campaign" by Seoul.^[107] South Korean military propaganda FM broadcasts were resumed at 18:00 (local time) starting with the song "HuH" by K-pop band 4minute.^[108]

As part of the propaganda broadcasts, South Korea reinstalled loudspeakers at eleven places along the DMZ. There was originally a plan to also use electronic signs, although due to cost, the plan was reportedly being reconsidered. On 13 June, South Korean media announced that the South Korean Defense Minister, Kim Tae-young, had said that anti-North Korea broadcasts were planned to resume after the UN Security Council took action against North Korea in response to the sinking of the Cheonan.^{[109]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ROKS_Cheonan_sinking}

Only your side is sinking that low. Even brainwash your own population.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CKpCGjD8wg&feature=related Some of Noam's thoughts.

This is an excellent book for anyone that still reads. esoteric-book-review-of-the-month-manufacturing-consent/

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Quoting Nitro Cruiser,

reply 15

Well if all the world has to do is "order" the "Empire" to leave, I guess there is nothing to fear. So here's the real question, why aren't they?

You are being funny ... right, hahaha. You obviously didn't read the article. The USG doesn't take kindly to the word "no", just like my teenager. It might have had to do with a change in strategy and volcanoes and bad negotiations, just a guess you see. My guess is that the USG wanted out else they would have coughed up the money after all it belongs to us … used to anyway.

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Quoting myfist0,

reply 18

Reply #18 myfist0

It is amazing to sit back and actually watch history repeat itself. I had my doubts when all they found was parts of a torpedo ... that's it? Personally, I do not think Mr. Doolittle (I know, the Teleprompter) has the nads to attack N. Korea, they will use proxies as usual when someone actually has some bite in them. This may be exactly the hook the USG is baiting China with ... before she becomes too big for her britches, so to speak. It isn’t that there is anything good in N. Korea besides the suppressed people, but the USG has got to be stopped from strong-arming the world at large.

"The Cheonan incident has all the markings of another Gulf of Tonkin incident. And as usual, the aggressor is accusing the intended victim of an unprovoked attack to justify a policy of aggression under the pretext of self-defense." Worked in Vietnam ... and that one cost 58,209 American lives.

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+350

All this lex parsimoniae avoidance is really quite funny.

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Quoting Daiwa,

reply 23

All this lex parsimoniae avoidance is really quite funny.

It is quite funny you use Occam's razor as it is the most simplistic explanation given the US governments method of starting wars in the past and its constant refusal to accept peace and need to continually feed the military industrial complex. Seems pretty simple to the whole planet. Not even the U.N. will blame NK. Russia almost laughed and China has no comment so you're left with the people left on the line alone pointing the finger.

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+350

Quoting myfist0,

reply 24

Not even the U.N. will blame NK.

Ooh, ya got me there. I take it all back. Can't possibly doubt the UN. Nope. Never. Good outfit, never suspect. My shame is overwhelming me right now so I think I'll call it a night & head to bed. Perhaps, if I'm lucky, I'll wake up dead in the morning so as to avoid continued mortification. Thank you, sir. May I have another?

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