The myths of harmless illegal immigrants

from JoeUser Forums
Drudge (link) is trumpeting a story from Breitbart original story link in reference to Operation Return to Sender.

Operation Return to Sender has resulted in approximately 2,000 illegal immigrants being rounded up and readied for deportation. For most of these illegals, it will be the second time, if not more, that they have been deported from this country. What is quite interesting to read in that original story is the information that talks about just who has been caught here, and what crimes they have commited.

I find it quite interesting that these people are rapists, murderers, child molesters, gang members and other violent criminals. I thought that the speechifying from the do-gooders and advocates for immigrants had long since convinced everyone that illegals aren't criminals, they are just people that want jobs, and just the jobs that nobody else wants or will do.

Hmm, I guess that myth was just that -- a myth.
politics
8,008 views 24 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
Hmm, perhaps the ICE agents should be on Mythbusters?
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
Some doofus on another board tried to tell me speeders were worse than the IIs.  I already pointed him to a story that showed how people are really hurt by IIs.  His response?  "So Illegals speed too?".  I think his mother squoze at the wrong time in her labor!
Groupy 2 - Organize multiple applications into grouped tabs on your Windows desktop
Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yes there are illegal immigrants who are criminals. But it isn't all of them. Most of them are law abiding people who just want to provide a better life for their family. Two thousand arrests out of 12 million illegal immigrants is a pretty underwhelming percentage. And yes I absolutely think they should crack down and deport the criminal element the problem is that many of these people were already previously deported. They just keep coming back. That is the real issue here.
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
Most of them are law abiding people who just want to provide a better life for their family.



When they come here illegally, breaking the law....then they are not law-abiding people. Breaking the law, and being Law-Abiding is two different things.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
When they come here illegally, breaking the law....then they are not law-abiding people. Breaking the law, and being Law-Abiding is two different things.


I mean they are not robbing, raping and murdering people. They are going to work and taking care of their families.
Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
When they come here illegally, breaking the law....then they are not law-abiding people. Breaking the law, and being Law-Abiding is two different things.


Exactly true, and while I understand Locamama's point here:
I mean they are not robbing, raping and murdering people. They are going to work and taking care of their families.


and could even possibly say something like "as a percentage, the number of criminals amongst illegals is lower than the percentage of criminals amongst U.S. citizens" (not that this is a real fact, or based in any way on any evidence I have ever seen or heard, it's just a comment that could possibly be made and may be truth or complete fiction), the facts remains exactly as stated in the first quote above - if you came here without completing proper processes, you are here illegally and you did break U.S. immigration law, no matter how screwed up you believe that law to be.


What might be very interesting would be to find out just how many of these criminals that were recently rounded up have been "just here going to work and taking care of their families" as many of them may have been doing. Meaning they have been relatively good citizens, but also had criminal pasts. Where do you stand then? Were they not criminals, just not criminals here, or once a criminal always a criminal?!

Either way, it's either naive or deceitful to claim that all of the immigrants that came here illegally are just peaceful people looking for work and the American dream. You could claim that "most of them" fit that description, but in the end all of them broke the law by coming here illegally or staying beyond the legal limits of what previously granted entry into the country allowed.
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top

Is that a real word? If not, I heartily nominate it for inclusion in the next edition of Webster's.

If you are asking me, you are asking the guy who has trouble spelling when!

Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
I mean they are not robbing, raping and murdering people. They are going to work and taking care of their families.


But the point remains, loca. This is why I firmly believe any solution should include a fairly simple means for those who do want to work in this country to do so legally. We want the hard workers, the people who are trying to care for their families, but we cannot afford to simply open our borders because it will allow the dishonest in along with the honest.
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yes there are illegal immigrants who are criminals. But it isn't all of them.


This makes no sense now, does it? If they are "illegal", they ARE criminals. As are the companies who hire them.
Reply #11 from JoeUser Forums Top
This makes no sense now, does it? If they are "illegal", they ARE criminals. As are the companies who hire them.


There are different kinds of Criminals. I would not mind one who smoked pot to be my neighbor, but would get very upset to find out I had a child molester living next door.

I understand Locamama's concern, and the poorly worded defense of the victimless criminals she is defending. That is the big difference. Most of the Illegals are guilty of victimless crimes, and in that I would agree with her.
Reply #12 from JoeUser Forums Top
It's ironic that the Illegal immigrant fans do not seem to grasp this. simply they broke the law by sneaking into America, it makes them criminals and as people that have no regard for the rules we make for citizenship.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top
~~I thought that the speechifying from the do-gooders and advocates for immigrants had long since convinced everyone that illegals aren't criminals, they are just people that want jobs, and just the jobs that nobody else wants or will do.~~

Every community has their share of bad people...why would it be any different for the illegal community?

But just like bad people make up a minority of our communities, this also holds true for theirs...the majority really are here to just earn a living for their families.
Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top

But just like bad people make up a minority of our communities, this also holds true for theirs...the majority really are here to just earn a living for their families.

And some to escape persecution.  But since they are not Cuban, but Venezuelan, and we do not as yet call Chavez (they do) a terrorist, they are not accorded the same status.  So they have to sneak in.

There are hundreds of stories out there.  And all of them different.  We as a nation have to secure our borders and start looking at dictators for who they are, regardless of their name.

Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top
Most of the Illegals are guilty of victimless crimes


I'm not sure how you would call this crime "victimless". These people use valuable resources that would have otherwise gone to American citizens. They also help huge companies maintain wages that any American, playing by "the rules" cannot afford to live on, hence the taking of jobs "Americans don't want". That is the biggest bunch of bullshit I've ever heard.

Illegal immigrants send , it is estimated, BILLIONS of dollars home to Mexico. This is money that will likely never be spent in the U.S.. Many of them do not pay taxes, nor do the "companies" that employ them. This means, in these cases money is being funneled directly to Mexico. It is invested in THEIR economy for THEIR purposes.

Housing, schooling, welfare and health care are all severely stressed by these people. Even the ones with the purest of intentions.

All of this is enabled by companies that flaunt the law, tempting people to come in illegally. Many of these people die trying to get here to get these, (OUR), jobs. Women, children, men..............the deserts, the sewers and the Rio Grande don't play favorites. Even should they make it, many are sick from the journey.

The estimated number of illegal immigrants in the U.S. is said to be roughly the size of the population of Ohio. This is a mass, corporate created invasion. The illegal immigrants motives should be no more an issue then a bank robbers financial status. I don't understand how these companies are allowed to continue violating the laws of this country.

There are victims Dr. Guy. Just because you aren't one, or you haven't noticed any, doesn't mean they do not exist.

We'd be better off just shipping the jobs to Mexico and let them deal with the infrastructure costs. These companies would be no loss at all in my opinion. They are traitors.
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
Traitors .... ?!



Whatever dude.... Maybe you should just go out and start shooting some of them. That'll lern em








Reply #17 from JoeUser Forums Top
Traitors .... ?!



Whatever dude.... Maybe you should just go out and start shooting some of them. That'll lern em








Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
Traitors .... ?!


Traitor: One who betrays another's trust or is false to an obligation or duty.

Yes, the owners of these companies, and the lawmakers who knowingly ignore what they are doing are traitors in my book.
"Shoot them"? No, I wouldn't go that far. I would throw their asses in jail for a good long time. Then we'd see how many illegal aliens we continue to get.

Does it not concern you when the leader of a foreign government is so in favor of the continuation of exporting his own population? There are NO background checks of these people. I seriously doubt if the human traffickers are looking out for the interests of U.S. citizens. Clearly these companies aren't.

Like it or not, this is America. I have to play by the rules or I will find myself in jail. So should they. Call it what you want. It's not legal and, it is a dangerous precedent that encourages people to do things contrary to U.S. law. Put them in a cozy cell ala Guantanamo Bay, bunking with the people they are helping stay in this country. They'll be wishing they would've been shot. Now THAT'll lern em!
Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top

There are victims Dr. Guy. Just because you aren't one, or you haven't noticed any, doesn't mean they do not exist.

You cant call a person who dies at his own hands a victim.  For then we are all victims.  And yes, you could possibly say that society is a victim due to the added cost.  But then, you would have to make that same argument for the welfare mom. 

No, there is no 'victim' of an illegal immigrants actions if that is their only crime.  Just as some would argue that prostitution is not victimless for it degrades the women, but then it is their choice to be degraded (yes, there are exceptions, but we will stick with the ones who willingly choose their profession). 

That would be a nice little schtick to be able to make a decision and then cry victim, which I am sure some liberals would love to do since their constituency seems to be based on victimhood.  However, it is not the case.  Anyone can make bad choices, and of course we use the term "victim of circumstances", but that does not make them victims.

Sorry, I do not agree.  It is victimless.  It is a crime. 

And as for the money they EARN, and send back to Mexico, since when is it a crime for anyone to decide what to do with the money they earn?  I have heard other conservative talk show hosts rail on that point, and I think that is specious.  We are not a communist society, yet that argument is the very one that such a society would make.  And I find it highly insulting.

And finally, being paid under the table.  That is a crime as well, but that is more a crime by the employer, not the employee, although both share the culpability.

Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top
And as for the money they EARN, and send back to Mexico, since when is it a crime for anyone to decide what to do with the money they earn?


When you make the money illegally, that's when.

No, there is no 'victim' of an illegal immigrants actions if that is their only crime.


Huh? No, I guess you're right. Children aren't victims. They choose to do what they do.

That would be a nice little schtick to be able to make a decision and then cry victim, which I am sure some liberals would love to do since their constituency seems to be based on victimhood.


That's funny coming from a member of a group of people that continually complain about being victimized by Democrats. I didn't know this was a liberal/conservative issue though. Your hatred of opposing positions shines through and through. When in doubt, call them a "liberal" and chastise them for all that you ignorantly believe they are.

And yes, you could possibly say that society is a victim due to the added cost. But then, you would have to make that same argument for the welfare mom.


I would make that argument for a "welfare mom" if they were illegal...yes. If they are a U.S. citizen, they are SUPPOSED to be given a little more clout than someone here illegally. And what about people at at the lower paying end of our society who's pay never changes because there is a pool of illegals filling underpaying jobs? They aren't victims?

And as for the money they EARN, and send back to Mexico, since when is it a crime for anyone to decide what to do with the money they earn?


When they are here illegally, using U.S. resources, many not paying any taxes.......that's when. The idea that they EARN anything is irrellevant. They shouldn't be here.
Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top

Huh? No, I guess you're right. Children aren't victims. They choose to do what they do.

No, the children are not.  DO you have proof they are being abused?  That would be a crime upon itself.

That's funny coming from a member of a group of people that continually complain about being victimized by Democrats. I didn't know this was a liberal/conservative issue though. Your hatred of opposing positions shines through and through. When in doubt, call them a "liberal" and chastise them for all that you ignorantly believe they are.

Gee, now we cant be indiviuals and must be a homogenous member of some faction.  WOW.  Do you know how ignorant that sounds?  Apparently not since you cant read what you yourself write.  Now if you want to debate the issue of creating victims and democrats that is a whole nother article.  Ands hatred?  I am so glad you can get inside my head and know what I am thinking and feeling.  Why should I write anything since you seem to know everything already.

NOT.

I would make that argument for a "welfare mom" if they were illegal...yes. If they are a U.S. citizen, they are SUPPOSED to be given a little more clout than someone here illegally. And what about people at at the lower paying end of our society who's pay never changes because there is a pool of illegals filling underpaying jobs? They aren't victims?

No.  They are not SUPPOSED to be given anything.  And they are criminals, so you are saying that some criminals are better than other criminals?  WOW Napoleon.  Next you will be getting the sheep to bleat 4 legs good, 2 legs better.

And no, they are not victims.  There is nothing to prevent anyone from taking those jobs.  We do have a minimum wage (since the 30s actually, I understand that might be too recent for you).  Rolling over and complaining about earning a living is just another symptom of victimology.  "Hep me! hep Me!  I am not good enough to earn 100k a year, so you have to support me".  Nice dodge.  But do you know what my grandparents called Minimum wage Jobs?  Opportunity.  You can leech off of society, or you can get out there get a job for experience and then make more.  But that is a foreign concept to victims.

BTW:  Most of the jobs they are taking are not minimum wage, but dirty, and do pay better than minimum wage.  But they are hard and dirty, so yes, many Americans would prefer not to soil their manicured hands.

And while I tried to keep the discussion on a non personal level, you appear incapable of it.  So go ahead and flame me again, for it will do nothing for your argument (or lack there of as the case may be), but dont expect me to lower myself to your apparent level. 

Try to at least get your facts right, and stop spouting about what you know nothing.  In other words, facts would help, instead of just flames and trolling.

Reply #23 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well, apparently you're good enough to make that 100k a year. Good On Ya! Maybe you should invest in a spell checker!
No. They are not SUPPOSED to be given anything. And they are criminals, so you are saying that some criminals are better than other criminals? WOW Napoleon. Next you will be getting the sheep to bleat 4 legs good, 2 legs better.


I've read, and re-read this statement over and over. I cannot believe that you are calling a "welfare mom", who is a United States citizen... a criminal. You are a pig. I don't know how you were separated from Hitlers teat, but now that you're here...open your eyes moron.

And while I tried to keep the discussion on a non personal level, you appear incapable of it.

Of course you don't want to get "personal". So you further talk out your ass a bit more and say that the 30's, as you understand it, may be too recent for me? Brilliant! "Welfare mom's are criminals"! Typical, I'm "ignorant". Then you follow that up with a "just the facts" statement.

Kiss my ass! Better yet, just continue to kiss dubbaU's ass.

Hep me! Hep me!? Let's all of us play a game. It's called.....guess this guy's opinion on.....things.

BTW: Most of the jobs they are taking are not minimum wage, but dirty, and do pay better than minimum wage. But they are hard and dirty, so yes, many Americans would prefer not to soil their manicured hands.
\

This is far and away, THE MOST ASSININE THING I HAVE EVER SEEN PRESENTED AS BEING "FACT". (With the exception of your absolute denial that Mexican children die trying to cross the border with their families.) Hep me! Hep me! I don't want to ruin my manicure with this dirty job that is an opportunity @ $5.15 and hour! Hep me!

It was just yesterday...I believe....when I was witness to a sign that said "Manicures! $.15! So, I guess you have a point here. It really pisses me off though. They are poor, complaining victims? Yet they are getting manicures? Your intelligence shines through. Yet again.

Your grandparents called minimum wage jobs opportunity huh? Was their "opportunity" warped by the influx of millions of illegal immigrants willing to work for squat? No. How do I know? Because this is unprecedented in the history of mankind....that's why!

There is NOTHING preventing people from taking these jobs? - Well, if Spanish is the language of choice? If they are allowed to live in a house with way more people than is allowed by law? If they are able to go without paying taxes?
Try to at least get your facts right, and stop spouting about what you know nothing. In other words, facts would help, instead of just flames and trolling.

And your "facts" are? Oh, I almost forgot. - I'm a old liberal. Yep! Got that one right. I guess that makes you smart, versus the "smart ass" you appear to be.

DO you have proof they are being abused?

Do YOU claim to know that children are NOT being brought across the border illegally? I've seen them running with their families. Do I have proof? No. I didn't have a camera. Does that mean it didn't happen? No.

Flame? I think you're hiding a flame right next to your high heels and cum soaked panties. Trolling? That's a great way to dismiss what you do not wish to see, or acknowledge.
Facts? Hold on....HEP ME! HEP ME!

Up yours prick! Get a life end an edumacation. dubbaU did! Don't misunderestimate the importance of knowledge!
Reply #24 from JoeUser Forums Top

Reply By: TheGuyPc

There is no point in responding to your hate filled diatribe.  Since you have lost the debate, we will leave it here.  I would suggest you invest in debating skills and google skills, and leave the trash talk to the gutter where it belongs.  But I doubt you can as you have so amply shown for all to see here.

Thank you for not only proving my point here, but Draginols on the other thread as well.