beware - gays are infiltrating city councils

sc POSTS:

Hey Lula - I hope gays invade your city council. Maybe they'll take you hostage.

If it makes you feel better, SanCho, they have taken me hostage at least as far as forcing my tax payer money to fund 1)---public school sex education that indoctrinates kindergarteners on up that homosexuality is healthy, natural and normal and 2)so-called same sex "partner" health benefits.

San Cho, in advocating full acceptance of homosexual behavior you must choose to downplay the incontrovertible evidence regarding the serious, life-threatening health effects associated with the homosexual lifestyle which is exactly what the Senator from Oklahoma is warning about. She understands that civil society has an obligation to institute policies that promote the health and well-being of its citizens and not push a small special interest group's "agenda" who lifestyle is full of chronic illness, psychological problems, debilitationg illnesses and deadly diseases.

There is enough medical information out there that alone should dissuade individuals from entering or continuing in an inherently unhealthy, dangerous and deadly lifestyle.

serious, life-threatening health effects associated with the homosexual lifestyle which is exactly what the Senator from Oklahoma is warning about

THe state senator from Oklahoma is not concerned about homosexual's health. She thinks they are a greater threat than terrorists. I don't understand how people can say I'm a Christian and then be so judgemental.

Also there are life threatening health effects as a risk to any sexual relationship unless it's a mutually monogamous one. So we should be promoting condom usage and gay marriage if we are really concerned about health effects.

I don't understand how people can say I'm a Christian and then be so judgemental.

It's Christian to judge behavior....we are not to judge individual's hearts or souls..

If you reread what I've written you'll see I have consistently spoken of the homosexual behavior otherwise known as homosexuality or sodomy which Catholic Church teaching condemns as "intrinsically disordered" and Scripture condemns as well...see 1Corinthians 6:9-10, 18-19 and Romans 1:26-27.

9Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

10Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

The bible also says that there are none who are righteous so does that put you in the same category as these people? Also why do we never hear about Christian condemnation of the other "sinners" only homosexuals.

I hate to get in a religous debate but here I go. The bible never condones slavery. Do you think that slavery is morally righteous? The books of the bible were written to the times they were written in by humans not God whether "inspired" or not. Humans decided which books to include in the Bible. Do you think we should stone adultresses? The bible says we can. Some Christians read the Bible and think it's okay to drink alchohol and others do not. Some Christians read the same Bible and think that its wrong to sing at church. Some Christians read that exact same Bible and think that they should dance with snakes.

The bible also says that there are none who are righteous so does that put you in the same category as these people? Also why do we never hear about Christian condemnation of the other "sinners" only homosexuals.

For me the answer is yes, a thousand times YES! All Christians are sinners and know it. The difference is that they choose to try to do something about it. Have you ever smoked cigarettes? Hang around a reformed smoker and they are just like evangelist only worse! They get into your business and try to convert you to non-smoking. Now think of a person that chooses to believe in the redemption of Christ. All sins are forgiven, past, present, and future. All you have to do is accept Christ as your savior, and try not to do the bad things you did in the past. What a weight is lifted off of you when you accept this. It is wonderful you want to tell the world how easy it is and how great you can feel. The people not saved are looking at you as I look at reformed smokers. Leave me alone, I smoke, I am a Marine and Marines never quit! So please understand the zeal of new Christians and the zealots that push past that we are supposed to do to try to demand you save yourself.

Now if you look at what Christians do if you choose to hang around them then you will see that they constantly point out that this is wrong and that is wrong, people that are sensitive to the wrongs pointed out see only that portion. So if you are sensitive to homosexuality you only see that aspect. If you are an adulterer you don’t notice the homosexuality so much you are too busy trying to avoid the guilt of your own sin. Carping about gays is easy because there are so few of them that even the adulterer can join in the chorus and hide what they are doing at the same time. If you worship idols then pick on the gays because maybe no one will notice your worshiping the cross or the tree or the rock of your religion. It is why the Catholic Church is thought of as the great whore, they encourage the worship of idols this is very bad but it is their religion and I am not going to tell them that, I have had this argument with a Deacon who is also my Uncle. I just point out that he believes in things that are not in the bible and he disagrees and we have dinner. Our life is our own we choose our path it you choose to be gay I don’t hate you but I will disagree that it is what is best for you. I may even point out why, after that you are on your own.

When you have a mob there is mob rule that has a logic all its own. all mobs are wrong and dangerous no matter what their original intention may be, it will usually end in people going out of control and doing things they would never do on their own. don’t blame the reason they became a mob blame the mob.

Do you think we should stone adultresses? The bible says we can.

The bible also says that we must obey the laws of the land as long as they don’t conflict with your belief in God. This is why we are allowed to work on Saturday the Sabbath, a crime punishable by death, or do you suggest I start stoning people who travel longer that the distance to their church? When I was in Jerusalem there were some orthodox neighborhoods where if you were seen driving past they would stone your car. This was 1979 and 1980 not a thousand years ago.

Some Christians read the Bible and think it's okay to drink alchohol and others do not.

This is where non Christians get into trouble, what is a sin to me does not have to be a sin to you. If I have trouble with alcohol then it is a sin for me to drink, if you do not have a problem with it then it is not a sin for YOU to drink. Dogma has taken over a lot of churches causing a lot of problems. It is a sin to eat certain meats, dietary laws for the Jews is very strict, for a reason, back then if you ate those foods you stood a better than average chance of getting sick and dying from shell fish, pork, deer, and so on. It was not until centuries later did we learn about trichinosis that is found in all animals on the forbidden to eat list. Wow that God guy is like physic or something, to think that he knew about it long before modern science discovered it. If you pay attention to what is allowed and disallowed by the Bible you will see that there is good reason for it in most if not all cases.

The bible never condones slavery. Do you think that slavery is morally righteous?

As for slavery, the bible does set rules for slavery and how slaves should be treated. Do you see that as approval or condemnation?

Lula posts: #51

in advocating full acceptance of homosexual behavior you must choose to downplay the incontrovertible evidence regarding the serious, life-threatening health effects associated with the homosexual lifestyle which is exactly what the Senator from Oklahoma is warning about.

She understands that civil society has an obligation to institute policies that promote the health and well-being of its citizens and not push a small special interest group's "agenda" who lifestyle is full of chronic illness, psychological problems, debilitationg illnesses and deadly diseases.

There is enough medical information out there that alone should dissuade individuals from entering or continuing in an inherently unhealthy, dangerous and deadly lifestyle.

Locamama posts:

THe state senator from Oklahoma is not concerned about homosexual's health. She thinks they are a greater threat than terrorists.

Yes, Sen. Kern is greatly concerned about the health of homosexuals....that's why she's has spoken up about it.

It's because tolerance has moved to full blown approval, acceptance and respectance of their deathstyle way of life. The practice of homosexuality, sodomy, bisexuality is now condoned in laws, indoctrinated in schools, in Hollywood, TV and movies, and in the mainstream news media that she says they are a greater threat than terrorists. Look at it this way, Loca. Through these outlets and institutions, there are millions of kids now being told homosexuality is just an alternate lifestyle...equal, normal and natural to heterosexuality. Well...that's a lie and empirical medical evidence has proven so but this is being ignored. These kids go ahead and sexually experiment with their bodies and guess what? They end up sexually confused and many with chronic and deadly diseases.

This is sexual terrorism that is striking millions of people that Sen. Kerns is warning about. The sooner we stop ignoring what is right in front of our noses, the better.

9Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

St.Paul here is teaching that those who die in mortal sin (and he enumerates some of those here) will not enter Heaven.

Jesus forgave the woman in adultery and told her to go and sin no more.

Our society that condones and indoctrinates homosexuality as normal, natural and equal, acceptable, respectable with sexual intimacy within marriage is actually encouraging sexual sin that St. Paul says condemns.

Also why do we never hear about Christian condemnation of the other "sinners" only homosexuals.

I did and do condemn the other sexual sins in reply #45. I wrote "Regarding sexual behavior and acting on it, I'm not singling out homosexuality. Every one of us is called to lead chaste lives. But for some reason, this class of sexual sinners feels the need to organize and militantly impose their views on the rest of us...even our children in kindergarten class. Who in their right mind can stay quiet about this?"

She understands that civil society has an obligation to institute policies that promote the health and well-being of its citizens

and I would reiterate that concern about the health of its citizens would include encouraging "safe sex" instead of the unrealistic abstinence only plans and also encouraging monogamous homosexual relationships by legalizing same sex marriage.

Locamama posts:
THe state senator from Oklahoma is not concerned about homosexual's health. She thinks they are a greater threat than terrorists.

lula posts:
Yes, Sen. Kern is greatly concerned about the health of homosexuals....that's why she's has spoken up about it.

Here's the latest about Sen. Kerns;

Death Threats and Thousands of Hate Emails from Homosexual Activists Hit Oklahoma Politician
Rep. Kerns calls comments exercise of free speech, not hate speech

By Michael Baggot

OKLAHOMA CITY, OK, March 17, 2008 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Oklahoma House Representative Sally Kern has received thousands of emails in light of a recorded speech posted on YouTube.com in which she called homosexual practices more dangerous to the United States than terrorism. The Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation is examining the 17 thousand emails Kerns has received for legally threatening content.

"It [the homosexual lifestyle] has deadly consequences for those people involved in it.... [they] have more suicides… there's more illness, their life spans are shorter… studies show that no society that has totally embraced homosexuality has lasted more than, you know, a few decades," said Kern in her speech.

"This stuff-it's deadly and it's spreading, and it will destroy our young people. It will destroy this nation. Not everybody's lifestyle is equal, just like not all religions are equal," added Kern.

Kern's speech was accessed more than 500 thousand times the week after the Gay and Lesbian Victory Fund posted it on YouTube.com.

"While this speech is remarkable in its statements, it is not unique. For every bit of hateful rhetoric we hear, scores of other anti-gay statements go unchallenged," stated the Victory Fund of Kern's speech.

"Her comments are so inappropriate and beyond the pale that she's demonstrated that she's not fit for service in public office," said Patrick Sammon, president of the gay and lesbian advocacy group Log Cabin Republicans.

Openly gay House Representative Al McAffrey has called for a public apology from Kern.

Kern rejected accusations that her comments were hate speech. "I am totally against hate speech. The account given on YouTube took my words out of context and omitted other parts stringing certain words together to make it appear I was engaging in hate speech. I was not and would never do such a thing," wrote Kern in an email to PamsHouseBlend.com, a gay and lesbian political advocacy blog.

"The homosexual agenda is real, the movement is aggressive, and it is a very real threat to the sacred institution of marriage and the traditional family unit. They are actively seeking to remove conservatives from the political arena. My talk was to a Republican group and I was speaking about the homosexual agenda to defeat conservative Republicans," Kern told PamsHouseBlend.

"They want to silence anyone who does not approve their lifestyle. They want their freedom but don't want those who disagree to have their freedom," continued Kern.

"I have said and will continue to say that they have every right to choose that lifestyle and I will defend their right to do so. But I do not have to agree with it and speaking against it is not hate speech," added Kern.

"There are indisputable facts that show it's a deadly lifestyle.... What is wrong with me as an American exercising my free speech rights on a topic that is a very big issue today?" Kern told New9.com.

Loca, you wrote that Sen. Kern is 'gay-bashing', should resign, and be ashamed of her bigoted views. You might want to re-think your assessment of Sen. Kerns.

Loca, you wrote that Sen. Kern is 'gay-bashing', should resign, and be ashamed of her bigoted views. You might want to re-think your assessment of Sen. Kerns.

Sorry, that article didn't change my mind in the least. I still think she's gay-bashing, judgemental, should apologize, should resign and should be ashamed of her bigoted views.

And I think you should be ashamed of your tolerance of sin.

I don't think it's sin. I think God is a fair and loving God and I don't think God would punish people for the way they're made. God loves homosexuals just as much as God loves you that's why God made rainbows.

God made rainbows to remind him that he isn't going to flood the world again, destroying almost all life on it.

Also, God is fair and loving. That's why He doesn't make homosexuals. Homosexuals are made by people's sin, or their own sins.

And yes. He loves them. He sent his son to die for them, just the same as you and me. That doesn't make it any less of a sin.

I also think people who have sex outside of marriage are sinning, too, just as badly. Or liars. Or gluttons. Etc. It's not the only sin. Just their agenda would have us believe that it's not their choice to sin. God knows whether it's their choice or not, and will act accordingly. But really it's all going to come down to, do they accept Christ or not?

Homosexuals are made by people's sin, or their own sins.

I don't believe that's true. That's your opinion and I disagree. I'm not going to change my mind.

But really it's all going to come down to, do they accept Christ or not?

See I don't believe that either. I don't think that only Christians are in heaven. I guess we'll find out in the hereafter who is right.

I also think people who have sex outside of marriage are sinning, too, just as badly.

Here's the kicker, you won't allow same sex marriage. They don't have the option of having a sexual relationship in a marriage with the person they love. You think God is going to judge them harshly for that?

35 And one of them, a lawyer, asked him a question to test him. 36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” 37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.” Mathew 22:35-40

This is my gospel.

Oh and I was joking about the rainbows.

God did not make Rainbows? I am Soooo Disappointed.

lula posts:

She (Sen.Kern) understands that civil society has an obligation to institute policies that promote the health and well-being of its citizens

Locamama posts :

and I would reiterate that concern about the health of its citizens would include encouraging "safe sex" instead of the unrealistic abstinence only plans and also encouraging monogamous homosexual relationships by legalizing same sex marriage.

Poor woman, you've got your head in the sand on this one too, Loca.

The facts are in....

Government instituted classroom sex ed is a plague that is devastating our youth. Government sex ed encourages kids to act out on what they are taught ...it sexualizes children and gets them using birth control which is the primary goal of Planned Parenthood who most often provides the curriculum, the materials and the birth control and condoms in the school based clinic.

Classroom sex ed encourages kids to engage in sexaul activity aka fornication. We've got a whole generation of fornicating pre teens and teens...and becasue of it, we are treating 1 in 4 with sexually transmitted diseases, some of them life threatening.

Anyone who encourages kids to engage in premarital sex is wrong, very wrong.

Woe to those adults who harm one of Christ's little ones. Better they were born with a millstone around their neck and thrown in the sea.

Jythier posts: #64

Also, God is fair and loving. That's why He doesn't make homosexuals. Homosexuals are made by people's sin, or their own sins.

Absolutely true. To that I would add that God is not a God of confusion. We've already scientifically determined there is no "gay" gene. God did not create homosexuals or the inclination. God created nature, the natural law and each one of us as male or female, in His Image, and said, "be fruitful and multiply". We are all orientated toward heterosexuality. Homosexuality is a disorientation, a confusion, perversion from the norm.

No one explains it better than Scott Lively in his book, 7 steps to recruit proof your children.

Each one of us were created as male or female designed to live together in the covenant of marriage and pro-create (beget children.). We are commanded by God to shun all other sexual relationships under pain of His Divine judgment. (Loca, this is what St. Paul was teaching in those Biblical verses you cited above.) God would not have created a genetic condition which sabotaged His own design, nor in His Infinite love would He have created an entire class of people with no choice but to engage in a sexual behavior which He had condemned.

Homosexuality is a sin against the commandment of God.

Leviticus 18: 22-30,

"Thou shalt not lie with mankind as with womankind, becasue it is an abomination. Defile not yourselves with any of these things....Every soul that shall commit any of these abominations, shall perish from the midst of his people...I am the Lord your God."

Romans 1:26-27, 32,

"For this casue God delivered them up to shameful affections. For their women have exchanged the natural use into that use which is against nature. And, in like manner, the men also, leaving the natural use of the women, have burned in their lusts one towards another, men with men working that which is filthy, and receiving in themselves the recompense which was due to their error...Who, having known the justice of God, did not understand that they who do such things, are worthy of death; and not only they that do them, but they also who consent to them that do them."

Here's the kicker, you won't allow same sex marriage. They don't have the option of having a sexual relationship in a marriage with the person they love. You think God is going to judge them harshly for that?

Knock, knock, where have you been Locamama?

Same sex "marriage" has been legal in the Netherlands since 2001 followed by Belgium, Canada, Spain, and South Africa...and civil unions in 11 other nations....here in the US, civil unions in Vermont and the Massachusetts Supreme COurt ordered homo "marriage".

And guess what about that love, love love?

According to research conducted by the Institute for Marriage and Public Policy, statistics show that once they are given the legal right, after an initial burst, the numbers of homo marriages drops off with each year.

In the Netherlands, only 6.3% of homosexuals got married. In Massachusetts, only 10.2 % of the homosexual population. And after that...guess what? Those marriages are very short lived averaging only 18 months AND included 8 yes, 8 additional sex partners outside the so-called "monogamous" relationship.

France which legalized civil unions in 1999, is finally waking up...yup...it's seeing the light of truth...the government commission issued a report in 2006 recommending against same sex "marriage". Imagine that? After assessing what has gone on in other countries and looking at their own sad state of affairs, the commission said, the best interests of children argue against same sex "marriage".

I don't believe that's true. That's your opinion and I disagree. I'm not going to change my mind.

Loca, what disturbs me is your intolerance to other people’s views. I don’t see people trying to change your mind, what I see are people explaining their point of view and you judging them as bad.
God created man and gave him free will, we can do whatever we want and he will still love us. He gave us laws to follow and if we fail to obey them he will punish us for it as a parent punishes a child for disobedience. It does not mean that he does not love us but we still broke the law. Your hate mongering and intolerance is sad. You expect everyone else to accept your way of thinking while disallowing others the same freedom to disagree with you or them. No one is saying you should be fired from your job because you tolerate homosexuality, you should be ashamed for your hypocrisy.

See I don't believe that either. I don't think that only Christians are in heaven. I guess we'll find out in the hereafter who is right.

If you understood the bible you would know that anyone and everyone can go to heaven and in the end all do for at least a while. Because of free will we all have the opportunity to go to heaven and even those that are not Christian can go to heaven you choose not to believe it so why do you care what others choose to believe?

Here's the kicker, you won't allow same sex marriage. They don't have the option of having a sexual relationship in a marriage with the person they love. You think God is going to judge them harshly for that?

Those people choose to believe what God said, that homosexuality is an abomination. They are following their faith and in this country it is majority rule, with homosexuals at only 1% of the population, don’t hold your breath waiting for the laws to change. As for God judging harshly I don’t see that happening. God set the rules and will judge on if you broke them or not and your intent. That is not harsh. Our laws say you can’t kill people and if you do you will go to jail and in some cases lose your life. It is fair according to the majority. God’s laws are fair if you wish to go to heaven. What’s the problem with that?

This is my gospel.

So where is the conflict, you agree that homosexuality is against God’s law and that supporting it is a violation of that law.

According to research conducted by the Institute for Marriage and Public Policy, statistics show that once they are given the legal right, after an initial burst, the numbers of homo marriages drops off with each year.

I had a look at imapp's website, but none of their published work on same-sex marriage is from after 2005. Are you taking these stats from somewhere else or are you relying on information that's not up to date?

It takes time to build something into a lasting institution, especially when straight marriages are such a poor role model. Do you have any figures from the past two years?

It takes time to build something into a lasting institution, especially when straight marriages are such a poor role model.

Let me understand you, and please correct me if I am wrong.

You say that straight marriages are a poor role model for gays? After 40 years of attacking marriage and families by the same liberals that want to blindly accept gay marriage as a right for them. First came the open acceptance of divorce, something that held a social stigma of men and women being defective in some way. Then no fault divorce came in vogue, this diluted the purpose of marriage to the point where people just got married for the gifts. It is so easy to get divorced that it was just easier and cheaper to live together. People lived together to see if they were making a mistake but who gets custody of the mistake when they break up? It became popular to be a single mother, another social safeguard gone. If you married you married for life in the past. You divorced for infidelity or physical abuse, now you get divorced if your partner eats crackers in bed, or your spouse changes their hair colour.

All of this for social change for the better, the result of liberalism unchecked, marriage is worthless to them. To the people that marriage has meaning they don’t want to have gays, a group of people that are already on the fringe of social acceptability that make no social contribution to the society. Gays are selfish and self-centered to the exclusion of all else. This is an unstable group of people that rarely stick with anything past the fad. It used to be in vogue to have a little lap dog as a child substitute. When the fad was over the dogs went to the pound. A few have adopted children, I shudder to think of what will happen when the children fall out of vogue. With marriage now nothing more that a sheet of paper it has become a status symbol. I understand that some few gay people really wish to be married for something other than the status and the tax benefits but they are few and far between.

When I lived in Missouri (pronounced misery) I met a guy who invited me to stay at his home while I hitchhiked across the country, he was married to a beautiful woman and shared their home with another couple. All four worked for IBM and in the early 70’s homosexuality was a bad thing. It turned out that the four were gay, on paper he was married to she but in actuality they lived with their same sex partner. No one knew they were gay, and they lived together through the 80’s till my friend died of AIDS. Oh wait I am homophobic by some standards so maybe he was not my friend but he thought I was his friend and I flew to his funeral and hugged his partner and did what I could to console him. I even showed up in my Marine Corps dress blues to honor his death.
Sorry I get a little emotional on this subject.

Lula posts:

According to research conducted by the Institute for Marriage and Public Policy, statistics show that once they are given the legal right, after an initial burst, the numbers of homo marriages drops off with each year.

I had a look at imapp's website, but none of their published work on same-sex marriage is from after 2005. Are you taking these stats from somewhere else or are you relying on information that's not up to date?

Do you have any figures from the past two years?

No, not that I can cite specifically or provide a link. I follow same sex "marriage" in Massachusetts (Nov. 2003) very closely. The trend there is the same as what is occurring in the other areas. The number of homosexuals getting married has dropped off year after year....now the divorces and custody battles are making the news. One little girl adopted by two lesbians now has 4 mommies. The whole thing is tragic and sickening...and everyone is hurt.

Lula posts:

Loca, you wrote that Sen. Kern is 'gay-bashing', should resign, and be ashamed of her bigoted views. You might want to re-think your assessment of Sen. Kerns.

Locamama posts:
Sorry, that article didn't change my mind in the least. I still think she's gay-bashing, judgemental, should apologize, should resign and should be ashamed of her bigoted views.

Jythier posts:

And I think you should be ashamed of your tolerance of sin.

Locamama posts:
I don't think it's sin. I think God is a fair and loving God and I don't think God would punish people for the way they're made. God loves homosexuals just as much as God loves you that's why God made rainbows.

Jythier posts:

Homosexuals are made by people's sin, or their own sins.

Locamama posts:
I don't believe that's true. That's your opinion and I disagree. I'm not going to change my mind.

I'd like to focus on one more point regarding this.

Throughtout the Gospels, we read that Christ did have trouble with the actions (immorality) of the adulterer, the effiminate, the prostitutes, and etc. He told them to go and do not sin again.

So Christ didn't applaud, accept or respect the woman caught in adultery for her "liberated lifestyle". He certainly didn't advocate making a new law to legalize prostitution so the prostitutes would not feel oppressed.

Yes, Christ loves us...but understand well that His love does not leave loved ones in sin. And neither should ours. That's the bottom line to this whole debate...these unjust laws (ie anti-discrimination sexual-orientation laws, same-sex domestic partnership health benefits, civil unions, same-sex "marriage" not only leave the loved ones in sin; they encourage the sinner to remain in sin. That's why these laws are fundamentally wrong.

beware - gays are infiltrating city councils

the gays are ruining America